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An interesting thing about Disneyland is that because Disney owns the whole place, they capture the spillover benefits of “Main Street”-style commerce in a way that is not possible in an actual Main Street.

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@atlanticesque

May 1

Sophisticated planners, architects, historic preservationists, community organizers, civic engineers, and other such putative experts will often dismiss urbanist ideas as wanting to turn cities into “disneyland.” But you know what? People *like* disneyland.

2:16 PM · May 1, 2025

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Matthew Yglesias

@mattyglesias

May 1

There’s a good independent coffee shop right by my house and also a good independent book store. People enjoy that kind of amenity, but in a real neighborhood the “it’s nice to have this nearby” factor is capitalized into home prices.

This means the coffee shop and bookstore owners don’t capture the full value of their existence, so we are going to systematically unproduce shops like that. Similarly, the benefits of investing in a building that looks nice largely accrue to the owners across the street.

Sometimes you’ll get an upscale mall (this is The Shops at La Cantera in San Antonio) that tries to replicate essentially a “beautiful commercial street” vibe. It’s a nice place to shop, eat, hang out, etc.

But San Antonio’s actual commercial corridors don’t look like this, in part because with the parcels all divided up it’s in each owner’s interest to underinvest in aesthetics and mobility and double down on “Giant Sign Plus It’s Clear Where You Park.” Not as nice!

This all suggests a bunch of regulatory ideas but in practice I absolutely do not believe that design review rules and processes have succeeded in getting nicer buildings built. You get compliance on the cheap not good taste and it kills originality.

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Alicia, Courtyard Urbanist

@UrbanCourtyard

May 1

Right, Disney doesn’t allow box retail with parking lagoons to go into a commercial plaza a mile away from the mixed use mainstream.

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Gradient Descent Into Madness

@GrdDscntN2Madnz

May 1

It also has a low crime rate

Matt, are you conveniently forgetting that the local government collects property taxes whether or not those businesses succeed? You’re better than this.

Disneyland (and American malls in their heyday) were just recreating ‘Old Town’ European settings in a private monopoly setting. So car dependent Americans have to drive there, park in the megastructures, then get a taste of downtown Vienna or whatever

Economists describe these as externalities. But the more socialist and centrally planned a town is in America, the worse the amenities and externalities are. Suburbs have the least main street community vibe, despite being socialist. Cities have the most as the most free market.

Boy do I have the project for you

They approximated it with Celebration in Kissimmee. Just need lots of associations and deed restrictions.

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@cptzc

May 1

What economic principle are you citing? I believe people would only underproduce if cost of beautifying is above their benefit but below their+neighbor's benefits. Bring costs of construction/facade beautification down you will get more of it.

Neither here nor there, but having gone there on an annual pass about twice a month for the last 17 years, sometimes you miss appreciating the simple, yet spectacular beauty of that introduction to another world(s), Main Street.